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 Post subject: Re: De-flasking, humidity solution for compots
PostPosted: Fri Sep 16, 2011 7:56 am 
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Joined: Sun Dec 05, 2010 9:06 pm
Posts: 133
Location: Boconó, Venezuela
What I do:

I open the flasks (normally 6 to 8) and let them stay for open for two days.
Than I have 2 ComPots (about 10" x 20") and the potting material prepared. I use as potting material a moistened mix of cocopeat (1 to 4mm), cocofiber (cut about 6 to 12 mm long), fine grade bark and some fine Styropore particles.
I wash the plants in a bowl and lay them on a sheet of newspaper to sort them for size.
Than I plant them in rows into my ComPots (6 rows of 7 plants in each ComPot).
That means that I get about 10 to 14 good plants per flask.
From the first night on they go into my greenhouse (min. night Temp. 12 oC, average night temp. 14 oC, year round. Night humidity is 100 % year round. Day humidity goes down to 38%. Light level where the ComPots are is about 800 footcandle. I water, so the medium is always moist.
I have a survive rate of more than 90% and the plants grow like weed. I seldom use fungicide because the coco has it naturally (at least that is what I learned reading about coco products.

Helmut


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 Post subject: Re: De-flasking, humidity solution for compots
PostPosted: Fri Sep 16, 2011 7:58 am 
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Joined: Sun Dec 05, 2010 9:06 pm
Posts: 133
Location: Boconó, Venezuela
Should say: I open the flasks (normally 6 to 8 and let them stay for open for two days.


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 Post subject: Re: De-flasking, humidity solution for compots
PostPosted: Fri Sep 16, 2011 9:17 am 
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Joined: Fri Oct 24, 2008 5:40 am
Posts: 192
Location: KS
Update on my phal babies....
After four weeks in their humidity chambers, I noticed some fuzzy mold growing along some of the roots. I applied Consan 20 (same active ingredient as Physan), at 1 tsp per gallon. I just lightly sprayed the area where I saw the fungus. Now, 10 days later, they are looking fine. I have removed the lids and have them still under grow lights in my living room. We are having fairly high humidity with cooler fall temps, and the plants are staying at 50-60% without the lids, at about 70 degrees. I water the plants with a small spray bottle, and apply water to the sphagnum lightly and not on the leaves. Once a week I add a small amount of MSU type fertilizer. I dab up any water that gets on the leaves with a kleenex. I have aliflor under the plants that I keep moist and this raises the humidity.

With previous flasks I received in December 2010, I did something similar. I didn't keep them covered unless the humidity was low in the room. I think one can go overboard with humidity. I've been concerned about getting a fungus, and also want the plants to start adapting to the same environment I grow the older Phals. I don't want to keep them in an incubator/flask-like environment too long. So far, I've noticed no browning on leaves, or anything that would indicate that they are suffering from low humidity.

Growing the young ones is so much fun. If you haven't tried it, I recommend it. And it's not that hard. Start with a compot if you don't want to do a flask. It's a very satisfying experience.

Susie


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 Post subject: Re: De-flasking, humidity solution for compots
PostPosted: Sat Sep 17, 2011 6:27 am 
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Joined: Sat Oct 10, 2009 11:09 pm
Posts: 1173
Yes, it is great fun. For me the biggest joy is having an entire population instead of just one plant. If you only buy one seed-grown plant of a cross or species you like, you are playing the lottery with only one ticket. With a whole population, you are payinjg less per plant and you are buying so many lottery tickets that you are very likely to win. You will probably have multiple winners, and the toughest part will be deciding which ones to keep growing. I love to see the variations.

I don't baby my plants. Sometimes, straight out of flask, they have laid around unpotted for several days, bone-dry (I don't recommend this, I only mention it because they are tougher than most people think). I pot them in sphagnum, or sometimes perlite + coco peat, and put the compots with 4-6 plants into a gallon ziplock baggie. I may leave the baggie loosely closed for the first weeks, and then leave the baggie open after that. The baggies are stiff enough (especially if you roll the top edges down a bit) that they stand upright, providing just enough protection from air movement to keep the plants happy. I do not use fungicide.

I do live in a humid climate, 50-80% always.

Lou


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 Post subject: Re: De-flasking, humidity solution for compots
PostPosted: Thu Sep 22, 2011 1:38 pm 
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Joined: Sat Aug 28, 2010 3:03 pm
Posts: 7800
Location: Boston MA USA
Would putting a seedling mat under the container of seedlings help? I'm in the Boston area and want to keep them warm and humid but not induce rot.


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 Post subject: Re: De-flasking, humidity solution for compots
PostPosted: Fri Sep 23, 2011 1:51 pm 
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Joined: Fri Oct 24, 2008 5:40 am
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Location: KS
Regarding heat mats. I de-flasked some Phals last December, and even though they were in my living room, it was too cool, so I put a heating pad under the tray and used a thermometer to monitor the temperature. This was a big help. Main thing is not to let them get too warm...set up the heating mat, test the temp for awhile, then put the plants in the tray.

Susie


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 Post subject: Re: De-flasking, humidity solution for compots
PostPosted: Fri Sep 23, 2011 4:30 pm 
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Location: Boston MA USA
How warm would be considered too warm?


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 Post subject: Re: De-flasking, humidity solution for compots
PostPosted: Sat Sep 24, 2011 11:12 am 
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Location: KS
I'm not sure. Maybe someone else can comment on this, but I was concerned about the heating pad just cooking them, ie., above 85-90 degrees. I would think you'd want 70-80 degrees for the range.


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 Post subject: Re: De-flasking, humidity solution for compots
PostPosted: Sat Sep 24, 2011 12:10 pm 
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Thanks, Susie, makes sense.


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 Post subject: Re: De-flasking, humidity solution for compots
PostPosted: Mon Sep 26, 2011 12:47 am 
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Location: Boston MA USA
Any suggestions for max humidity? Even without the mister running, I'm getting 99% which seems a bit high.


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 Post subject: Re: De-flasking, humidity solution for compots
PostPosted: Mon Sep 26, 2011 10:49 am 
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Location: KS
Here's my observation. For the first two weeks, I keep the newly deflasked babes at 80-90 percent humidity, but I watch them, and at the first sign of any fungus, I spray with Consan, and reduce the humidity a bit. After two weeks, I keep them at 60-70 percent. I have noticed no browning on the edges of the leaves with this treatment, which is supposed to be the signal that the humidity is too low. However, I don't know if they would grow faster if they had more humidity? I just don't like to keep them too closed up for too long, because eventually, I think fungus will be a problem. The down side to lower humidty, is you have to check the plants daily to see that they have enough moisture at their roots. I water them lightly every 3 days, and sometimes apply a mist around the roots in between. So for those who have less time to monitor plants, I can see wanting the higher humidity.


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 Post subject: Re: De-flasking, humidity solution for compots
PostPosted: Mon Sep 26, 2011 12:13 pm 
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Joined: Sat Aug 28, 2010 3:03 pm
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Location: Boston MA USA
Thanks for your input, Susie.


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 Post subject: Re: De-flasking, humidity solution for compots
PostPosted: Fri Oct 21, 2011 3:18 pm 
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Joined: Fri Oct 03, 2008 9:49 am
Posts: 287
Location: Düsseldorf, Germany
I have a kind of different approach: I keep my seedlings in table greenhouses and stuff in as much as I can. The ventilation is closed the hole time to keep the seedlings under a tense atmosphere. You can hardy look into because of all the water droplets. The seedlings grow in sphagnum (live moss, if I can get it, depends on the season) and I do not check the humidity or water more than every few weeks. Till now it works for me. No fungus, no rotting roots and the seedlings grow well. :D

It is not my method but something I learned from experienced growers. Especially one saying stuck with me: "Seedlings don´t want to be alone, they want to talk to each other". :lol: So if there are enough seedlings potted close enough, they develop their own micro climate. And the rest just falls in place.

The table greenhouses look like this most of the time:

Image

And thanks to gravity or phisics, the water seldem falls down on the seedlings but rather flows down the walls of the greenhouse.

_________________
Sonja

http://www.flickr.com/photos/30770883@N03/


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 Post subject: Re: De-flasking, humidity solution for compots
PostPosted: Fri Oct 21, 2011 7:14 pm 
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I love your mini greenhouses...those are perfect. They're just like those domed seedling flats I was talking about.


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 Post subject: Re: De-flasking, humidity solution for compots
PostPosted: Fri Oct 21, 2011 8:22 pm 
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A while back, Jayfar mentioned a comprehensive Phal reference site authored by: T. Ikedo, Y. Taniguchi and Y. Seshita. I highly recommend it. http://www.ranwild.org/Phalaenopsis/Eindex.html

I learned some new things but one in peticular that can help us with our seedlings is that Phals are CAM plants...ie. can carry out "Crassulacean Acid Metabolism". In a nut shell this means that in high humidity conditions at night, the Phal can open its stoma and absorb CO2, convert it to malate and later utilize the stored CO2 during the day. (Most plants cannot utilize CO2 at night)

Just one more reason to keep the humidity high for our seedlings, day and night.


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